The Real Fight of the Year?
posted by Large
Dudes, again I refer you to my piece at The Sporting Blog, which touches on a subject near and dear to our hearts, the two gigantic, rival promotions of the fall.
To which I will add that this annoying situation where I am generally writing my pieces over at TSB and then linking to them here is going to be resolved soon once and for all, and I think to everyone’s satisfaction. More on that very soon…
Mayweather/Marquez vs. Pacquiao/Cotto Could Be the Fight of 2009
“If Floyd really wants to take a sure path towards making this fight enormous, and if he wants to immediately supersede any other news that surrounds him or his camp or the fight as it is posited right now, he has it in his power to do so… All he has to do, with his inimitable gusto, is insult the honor of Mexican boxers, Mexican people, and Mexico itself. Then, oh man … then all hell would break loose.”
August 19th, 2009 at 2:37 pm
Great piece. One thing I don’t understand is why Marquez isn’t as iconic a figure in Mexico as Barrera and Morales are. He’s the type of guy they love – no one has more heart and he is a truly great fighter, an all-timer. As far as Pac/Cotto goes, as someone alluded to recently, Roach has been kind of opportunistic with Manny’s career, in terms of setting up fights with these larger guys. He knew Oscar couldn’t “pull the trigger anymore,” as he put it, that’s why he let Manny take the fight. He said himself that he would have never put Manny in there against Oscar in Oscar’s prime. He knew Ricky would be no match, because he just wasn’t good enough – couldn’t handle the speed, couldn’t switch up, etc. He KNEW these things, even if no one else did. That’s why he’s Coach Roach. And so I’m thinking he probably knows something about how Cotto matches up with Manny – and something tells me the answer is not well. Or else he wouldn’t have let Manny fight him. Right?
August 19th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
The reality is that the Mexican public feels sorry for Mayweather. They don’t blame him, they blame his family for how he acts. Basically with no class at all. He has been raised by dysfunctional people to be a very good boxer.
Yet, he has a trainer who strangles a female and to top it off…she is one of his own people. Very sad. He doesn’t speak to his father…how sad is that. Where some people see it as compelling, Mexican people think…how can a father and son lose touch like that and then be in the same room…that is not a compelling story, it is f’en sad to Mexicans.
As for the fight, I think Mexican folk would much rather see someone who comes forward and comes to fight and not dance around the ring. It is like, why do we want to pay someone to run from JMM? Think about it…do you think the LA Forum use to get packed like it did back in the day because Danny “Little Red” Lopez use to run around the ring? No, it was packed when he would fight because people wanted to see a good fight, not a goof ball hit once and run.
In closing, where Floyd could be a credit to his people he just mouths off and shows us how his parents raised him…it really is sad. Thus, I don’t think it is about him insulting the Mexican people…it is far more than that why Mexicans won’t purchase that fight. Just my take.
August 19th, 2009 at 2:54 pm
Marquez is a quiet personality, and he fucked up his own career, refused a rematch with Pac after their first fight and then went to Indonesia and fought (and lost, disputably) a bout with Chris John. Meanwhile, Barrera and Morales were fighting the definitive fights of their era. Add in that Marquez isn’t quite the Warrior style-wise that the Mexicans clamor for, and I think you have the reason he hasn’t been worshipped a la Morales and Barrera.
Also, I guess you could just say it was having Morales and Barrera as contemporaries. Who knows how huge Joe Frazier might have been were it not for the existence of a certain someone.
Unlike Oscar and Hatton, I don’t think Roach is feeling certainty on the Cotto question. He’d rather have Cotto than Shane is what it boils down to, I think, which to my mind is debatable. Something tells me when Shane goes back in the ring he’s going to put up an egg. I don’t know why I feel that way but it’s just… I think he’s gotten a little too much of a boost in his Q rating after that Margarito win, against a Tony who may have come out of the Cotto fight worse than Cotto did.
Anyway, Floyd removed himself from consideration, Pac’s team wants only mega-fights, and that left them with only two options, and they chose what they saw as the lesser of two evils, aided considerably by their promoter’s interest in the matter (who really ramrodded this thing down everyone’s throats). But I doubt in his heart Freddie is feeling like he KNOWS something about Cotto the way he knew, the way we all knew, something about Hatton, namely that he sucks.
August 19th, 2009 at 2:56 pm
Rooster, you really telling me that you think if Floyd went gangbusters trashing Mexicans that it wouldn’t get more Mexicans to watch the fight? I, uh… I really beg to differ. The Mexicans I know love boxing and are proud as fuck, and where right now I sense they are far less interested in Floyd/Marquez than Pac/Cotto, if Floyd started talking a bunch of shit about them, I have a feeling it would get their attention real quick.
August 19th, 2009 at 3:27 pm
Large you should have been a fight promoter. You could have Floyd “Money” Mayweather talking trash about Mexicans, while wearing millions in blink. He could talk about illegal immigration and building a wall to protect his “money” from the Mexicans. Christ, this story might even make national news. A rich American boxer complaining about all the Mexicans. That would play well on talk radio and may stir up interest. Mayweather would of course represent the wealthy, greedy “Masters of the Universe” type whose greed helped ruin the economy. It’s a role he enjoys playing. Marquez would represent the hard-working, lower class, common man who simply wants an opportunity to better his life…..It’s a perfect time for this little drama to be played out. What working man out there doesn’t want to see some rich,greed fuck get his ass beat by the powerless common man? And you know there are a lot of rich people who would love to see a Mexican stomped by a wealthy American. It’s a natural. I wonder why they aren’t promoting it this way?
August 19th, 2009 at 3:51 pm
Brad, they will… they will. It’s just too much of a natural, and their backs are really up against the wall, and I don’t see any other way for them to make this thing big. I’ve been waiting for the anti-Mexican tirade for a while now from Floyd, and when I heard Schaefer saying this would be the biggest PPV of the year yesterday, even granting that of course he’s going to push this fight, I thought to myself he sounds like someone who thinks he’s got an ace in the hole.
I think BHop Tito and Hopkins stomping on the PR flag. That thing did 500K as I recall, roundabouts anyway, and it wasn’t a 500K level matchup going in. It got a lot more juice than it might have given the 9/11 situation and the fact that it was at the Garden, but still… BHop stomping on that flag was the story of that fight. Until of course BHop stomped on Tito.
August 19th, 2009 at 11:15 pm
man..imagine floyd on hbo telling JMM that he and raffy can come landscape his property after the fight? lol
i wonder if the inability of JMM to really connect with mexican fights has anything to do with the rumors that he prefers the company of men?
August 20th, 2009 at 6:24 am
I doubt it Ricky. As Large points out, Mexicans love the stupid, straight ahead, defense is for cowards type fighter. Anyone fighter that is good at ducking,sidestepping, weaving or rolling with punches is not really going to connect with mexican fans. Hell, if Sugar Ray Robinson was a Mexican, I doubt he’d really have connected with them because of the way he fought.
August 20th, 2009 at 8:10 am
true brad
August 20th, 2009 at 8:18 am
Interesting read. If Floyd goes that route, I wonder how he does it? Floyd’s counterpoint to critics re coming back against a smaller JMM has been that JMM is an especially tough fight, he beat Manny, he has an entire country behind him, etc. Basically, Floyd’s been praising JMM to justify the fight. Does Floyd fall on his own sword if he changes his tune and starts ragging on JMM or his fans or both? There might be a way to do it – it’d be interesting to see.
August 20th, 2009 at 9:25 am
sentimental…floyd has been talking this fight up as a better one that most think it is…but in reality..if he starts trashing on JMM and mexico…would that really make somebody be like “but i thought he said this was a legit fight. now i dont wanna see it”?? i highly doubt it…by the time 24/7 airs…the casual fan will either not have heard most of floyds prefight talk….or will have forgotten it….so i think going that route can really only help numbers…no matter how he chooses to do it
i honestly dont know if he does go that route though…which is partially why i feel like hes going to open up on JMM and let his performance speak for itself….there is certainly alot of time to fill on a 24/7 series…but i can imagine a scene where he pulls up in a phantom or a lambo draped in jewels saying something like “and they say im broke and owe the IRS 6 mil”….i can see him watching pac/jmm fights…and hbo showing parts where marquez is getting the best of pac….
August 20th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
The new “Replay” rule should be in place by this fight. I don’t know what to think about it.
August 20th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
I like your premise Large – I think it would add some flavor to what has thus far been a lackluster promotion. But I’m not sure Floyd using any ethnic slurs would really increase sales that much. I don’t think either guy has a huge following because of their counterpunching styles. People kind of expect ignorance from Floyd anyway – if he starts getting racial I think folks would just ignore it. Besides, I think Al Haymon is actually trying to make him into a little more of a crossover act. Mexophobic (just made that up) banter doesn’t really play into that.
I’m predicting that it does less than 500k in sales maybe even less than 400k.
August 20th, 2009 at 9:53 pm
Kurt, man, I’m with you. I’ve been saying for a while that I have the pre-24-7 over/under on this fight’s PPV count at 500k and most people I’m saying that to are like, “ninja plaease.” And I’m like… ninja PLEASE! I don’t understand who could possibly have this fight doing 700-800k right now, let alone more than that. It has zero juice. If Floyd isn’t going to turn into a rampant Mexophobe, then he better think of something else right quick, cause mama he’s freezin… (mama he’s freezin).
August 21st, 2009 at 4:05 pm
As far as Floyd trashing Mexicans he did already wear a backwards sombrero in his fight with DLH and Roger called himself “The Mexican Assassin” (who got trashed twice by JC Chavez). So the trash talking isn’t that far off for him.