Double Standard for Dimitriy?
by Ron Ross
(Large and I heard Ron Ross read from his highly recommended Bummy Davis vs. Murder Incorporated at Think Tank 3 gallery two years ago during Charles Miller’s amazing show, Jewish Boxers. Ron is like the Jose Oquendo of the sweet science–he’s fought, managed, promoted and chronicled. Today he plays umpire, calling some recent cries against our man Dimitriy Salita foul.-CI)
Let’s call it the Ethnic Divide. Latin fans generally root for Latin fighters, Irish fans for Irish fighters, Italian fans for Italian fighters, African-Americans for African-American fighters and Jewish fans for Jewish fighters. It’s the way things are and there is nothing wrong with it as long as it remains in the arena of fair competition. It is not prejudice, at least not in the accepted sense of the word. In fact, it is one of the backbone elements in matchmaking , the crowd coming out and rooting for the local kid. ‘Local†is defined by more than just the neighborhood. But it can tailspin into the ultimate in ultra-poor sportsmanship when a fighter’s winning efforts and recognition of accomplishments are not merely consistently minimized, but are mocked because of it. Anytime a fighter goes to the well thirty times and comes back without a defeat he deserves praise, cheers and admiration , unless he comes from a place other than the Planet Earth. Dmitriy Salita is not an extra-terestrial.
There are fighters who have fought the equivalents of their grandmothers in compiling a ‘looking good on paper†record. Despite the hoots and put-downs of his growing legion of detractors , the silent hecklers are now emboldened and stepping forward as the ranks of vocal detractors grow , the quality of Dmitriy’s opposition is better than most of his contemporaries and even most of the list of sacred ‘golden age†greats. His opponents have won 369 of 590 fights for a 625 percentage. In comparison, Ricky Hatton, in his first 30 bouts, fought opponents with a 570 percentage, Andreas Kotelnik’s opposition 554, and Junior Witter’s, a still respectable 510. We then come to former WBA titleholder, Gavin Rees, who in his 26 bouts prior to fighting for , and winning , the WBA light-welterweight crown, came in on the back of opponents that won only 305 bouts out of 1,040 , a 290 percentage. And rather than denigrate or belittle his accomplishments, they sang his cheers and accorded him a champion’s veneration. Cinderella never had it so good!
Yet, Dmitriy Salita, who has fought a more imposing list of opponents than any of those mentioned – and we can comb a list of fighters past and present and come to what may be a startling and even disturbing fact to the naysayers , Salita did not build his record on humpty-dumpties or tomato cans.
Okay, let’s look at some of our ‘legends.†No one can deny Willie Pep his well-earned legacy as one of the greatest featherweights ever to lace on the gloves. But the ‘Will o’ the Wisp†started his career with each fight being an education until his baby steps were able to evolve into big time giant steps. Pep’s first 30 opponents had a combined total of 396 fights of which they won only 163, a percentage of only .411! Of his first 10 opponents, 9 had never won a single fight! This is not to demean the career of a truly great fighter. It is simply a measuring rod to put things in an historical perspective. Rocky Graziano, another guy who earned the right to have his fists cast in bronze, went out to win at any cost, with the crowd cheering him on with his late-round desperation rallies. He fought most of the great ones but his early career was not exactly star-studded. His first 30 opponents had a combined total of 630 fights, losing 386 against only 244 wins for a won-loss percentage of .387.
Comparing Dmitriy’s .625 percentage to all of the above-mentioned does not take into account all possible variables but no matter how you choose to slice it, it certainly opens up the door to a respectable argument. The cry that Dmitriy is being protected, that his opposition is hand-picked is the same quality criticism, but from the other end of the field, to the clamoring of a kid being ‘thrown to the wolves†when an up-and-coming fighter suffers a loss. Sit back and join the Monday morning quarterbacks, the easiest job around.
In this situation there are more serious overtones. When a fan , someone on the sidelines , is the one making such disparaging accusations it will gather a listening audience of varying numbers, there will be some nods of agreement or disagreement until a new topic replaces it on center stage but when the villifiers, the maligners are the promoters, or those who pull the promoters’ strings there is just cause for the fighter and his management to be concerned. Dmitriy was told by a pay TV executive that he doesn’t have the fan base of a Latin fighter. Does this smack of some sort of unfair, somewhat biased criteria in weighing a fighter’s qualifications for a title match. Should a TV/Promotional giant such as HBO have the power to bypass a #1 ranked challenger for someone lower on the list to satisfy its personal and/or perceived financial motivations. By being ranked #1 a fighter has earned his right to climb through the ropes as the rightful challenger. To be deprived of this , no matter the reason, is depriving the fighter of his livelihood, displacing him from a position he has earned with blood and sweat, not by sitting behind a mahogany desk dreaming up some out-of-left-field rationale of why number 7 should come before number 1.
*************
Ron Ross’s books include The Tomato Can, a novel, the widely acclaimed Bummy Davis vs Murder, Inc., and his latest book, NINE… TEN… AND OUT! THE TWO WORLDS OF EMILE GRIFFITH, a biography of the great middle and welterweight champion of the 1960s and 1970s.
See the latest episode of the Undercard with Dimitriy Salita on NoMasTV.
March 26th, 2009 at 10:40 am
That picture is amazing. I’ve been staring at it for the last half-hour straight.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Right on Ron!! Let’s give the man a chance to prove himself against the best in the world. HBO needs to step up to the plate.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:52 pm
[...] first comes from our old friend Ron Ross on whether the fighter is facing a double standard, as per Nomas-nyc.com: Let’s call it the Ethnic Divide. Latin fans generally root for Latin [...]
March 26th, 2009 at 6:08 pm
Well it’s not like the kid hasn’t tried to get in the ring with better competition. He was supposed to get a title shot against Kotelnik. He’s really fun to watch, hopefully he’ll get some of the spotlight this year.
March 27th, 2009 at 9:33 am
@ Tinns
pic is by No Mas friend Alex Tehrani and originally appeared in the Fader as part of story Alex and I did on Dima a couple years back. Agree it’s a great one. Dimitriy has the whole piece roughly scanned and posted on his website:
http://www.dsalita.com/pdf/fader.pdf
check out more of Alex’s work at:
http://www.alextehrani.com/
March 27th, 2009 at 12:22 pm
good stuff
hate it or love it…its one of those things we must put up with in order to enjoy the sport
unfortunately its all about who you roll with…if yer rolling with top rank, golden boy, or a frank warren…yer gonna be able to get yer crack at a strap…unfortunately for someone like dmitry…he was with lou…and while lou isnt chopped liver…hes not quite up there with the major players…and hes been much more focused on moving guys like jermain,paulie, berto, and a few others….guys that appear to have more talent, to compete on the world class level, than dmitry…lou only has so many resources…and he was happy selling out his local shows with dmitry….its too bad…hopefully he finds a way to get a shot
not to hijack this thread…but how about margs huh? wow…margs is officially over….wheres ryan? havent seen him in awhile…
March 27th, 2009 at 4:36 pm
Actually I’ve heard it through the grapevine that we’ve pissed off Ross Greenburg with all of our kvetching – so I don’t mind you hijacking the thread Ricky.
It boggles the mind that a modern day fighter would try something as stupid as plaster paris in their gloves. I guess it’s even more mind-boggling that he may have gotten away with it for a number of fights and if not for the keen sensitivity and professionalism of Brother Nazim – he would have been hitting Mosley with loaded gloves.
I’m sure his hand-wraps from previous fights are long gone so there’s no way to test them but Margarito is now marked as a cheater. Lord knows when his suspension is up, Arum will still be able to find a place in the US that will license him. I guess the only real repercussions for Arum are the cooling of his relationship with Cotto because of his support of Margs through this mess. I’ve heard Cotto is thinking of just going solo rather than resigning with Arum when his contract is up.
March 27th, 2009 at 7:05 pm
I know this is way off topic but speaking of HBO, I just finished George Kimball’s outstanding book Four Kings about Leonard,Duran,Hearns and Hagler. Kimball tells a funny story about Sugar Ray Leonard. In July of 1990, Leonard had just got divorced. He was working as an announcer for HBO. HBO had the broadcast rights to the early rounds of Wimbledon. A number of high ranking HBO executives including Seth Abraham and his wife Lynn had a box at Centre Court for the final. Leonard had two tickets for the box and had intended to go with his bodyguard James Anderson. However, our man Sugar Ray and Anderson got drunk the night before and never showed up, but a couple of scantily clad ladies bearing tickets did. Abraham was pissed. He said “there attire was totally inappropriate, I mean you don’t have to wear a gown to Wimbledon but they were dressed like a couple of hookers.” There’s was good reason for that, they were a couple of hookers.
Leonard told Kimball “It just wasn’t cool on my part. I think I was just hung over and wasn’t thinking.”….Leonard went on to say he thinks that incident might be the reason his contract with HBO was not renewed.
March 27th, 2009 at 11:06 pm
now that is great story brad.
March 28th, 2009 at 12:40 am
brad is fucking full of em
March 28th, 2009 at 1:13 am
kurt…didnt see yer reply before i posted my last one…probably because im fucking drunk
but yeah…ive heard the rumors of cotto leaving top rank at the end of the year…when his contract is up….and who can blame him….one has to wonder…should pac be victorious may 2nd…will arum try to offer a pac fight to cotto as penance…in attempt to bring him back in…and keep the fight in house…before cotto could flee to somewhere like golden boy and hold an upperhand
March 28th, 2009 at 7:28 am
Ricky, even though you were “fucking drunk” your thinking was still very sound on the Cotto/Arum matter(that’s a good quality to have, few people think at all when they are drunk let alone think clearly). He needs to try to save his relationship with Cotto. A fighter he promotes, possibly loaded his gloves and damaged Cotto’s career…and Arum defends Margs? Why?……Margs has got no where to go. He could have the matter in a much more delicate fashion, but to suggest that the “light” penality was unjust must have pissed Cotto off big time. Dangling the Pacquiao to Cotto is the only solution for Arum. He’ll make tons of money and Mayweather will want the winner. No lose for Arum.
March 29th, 2009 at 8:44 am
What do you guys see happening with Mosley? It’s almost like he’s being punished for kicking Marg’s ass. Cotto, Mayweather, Marquez are all interested in the Pacquiao Hatton winner. I’m just not sure many doors opened for Shane after he complete trouncing of Margarito.
March 29th, 2009 at 11:35 am
i dunno brad…shane is in a shit position right now…its unfortunate…
its funny to me…cause i thought people overreacted to his win over mayorga…read too much into it…and said he was washed up…now i feel some people may be underrating his performance against margs…saying things like “margs was a beaten man when he knew his jig was up” and “margs head was out of it when he stepped in the ring”….shane is still badass if you ask me….and as great as i think floyd is(and i think hes great…i favor him over anyone)…i dont think floyd wants to get in there with shane(at least not before hes able to feast on pac or whoever)
the most logical thing would be to fight cotto again….but we know cotto has msg booked for the even of the PR day parade…and shanes not stepping into that…i was at cotto/shane…and its funny because i said the same thing shane said about the fight while i was there to a friend…the crowd had a bit of influence….he thought cotto won…i thought shane won or deserved at least a draw…although watching it replayed on tv…i could see how the decision was fair…but i dont blame shane for not wanting to go there again…especially the eve of the parade
this whole picture can get even murkier should pac lose to hatton(at this point im leaning towards hatton)…or should arum try to offer cotto a pac fight at the end of the year to save their relationship…itll be intersting to see how this shit plays out….there are 5 or 6 special fighters here…and several intereting matchups that can be made
March 30th, 2009 at 11:08 am
Paul Malignaggie is not more talented than Dmitriy, he was better promoted than Dmitriy, that’s true
March 30th, 2009 at 12:18 pm
I think Arum is going to try to keep some of his big fights “in the family” so to speak. He’s keeping Cotto and Pac away from Mosley and Mayweather b/c he’d rather make a superfight b/w the two of them where Top Rank makes all the bread. Absolutely makes sense from a business perspective.
As far as Mosley goes, it seems like he’ll have to look for either a Berto or Mayweather fight to fill out his 2009. A stay busy fight in the summer wouldn’t be a bad idea. There’s always Zab Judah – lol – or Carlos Quintana or Delvin Rodriguez. Obviously, Luis Collazo deserves another shot at a title, but Shane already beat him decisively so that’s a non-starter.
Ricky – the fact that you’re leaning towards Hatton is against the grain but I definitely feel people are writing him off too quickly in this fight. Pac looked great against a washed up Oscar but how will he deal with a goon like Hatton. I think this is a really competitive fight – I’m thinking Pacquiao by decision (too much hand speed), but I wouldn’t be shocked if Hatton mugged him and pulled the upset.
March 30th, 2009 at 1:07 pm
Kurt- I would be shocked if Hatton pulled the upset. I think Hatton’s got big problems with Pacquiao. I actually think he matches up better with Mayweather. The reason is because Hatton isn’t very clever or tricky moving in on an opponent. He tends to come directly in showing little head and upperbody movement. Floyd didn’t really even try to move that much. I don’t think Ricky’s offense scared him in anyway. Floyd would simply turn his shoulder and cover up and pot-shot him back because he was such an easy target. Oscar got to Mayweather easier than Pacquiao for the same reason. Floyd doesn’t really move all that much. Pacquiao does, and he’s quicker than Money Mayweather. He’s all over the place. You can’t time Pacquiao. He’s reminds me a little of Aaron Pryor; coming at you from all these bizarre angles. His footwork is amazing. You need to be very quick and accurate to stand a chance against him. Hatton may be quick, but he’s not accurate.
Against Mayweather, Hatton’s inside game sucked. I think it will be worse against the always moving Pacman. Hatton will have a very hard time hitting Pacquaio, my guess is he’ll looked ineffective and confused by round 4. I see a one sided Pacquaio fight possibly ending on cuts…..then again, I didn’t really see how Shane Mosley, coming off a kind of tough fight with the clown Mayorga, was going to do anything against the rock chin Antonio Margarito back in January. Who knows. I can’t wait though.
March 31st, 2009 at 10:52 am
these are really just some of my preliminary thoughts on this fight…
but brad…i dont think comparing the oscar floyd fought to the oscar manny fought is fair…de la hoya fighting at 154 wheres hes been for years…and then going to 147(wasnt it really like 145?? i was shocked at how he came in under and didnt put anything back on before the fight) for the first time in like 7 or 8 years
when i look at pacs resume…i see the same thing over and over…mexican fighters…who stand right in front of him…the last time he fought a real fighter…i fully expect pacs handspeed and countering to be a bit of problem for hatton…or for anyone…but pac is gonna be in there with someone that has sort of that bouncy energy that he does…i just really think ricky is going to improve with another camp under floyd sr…ricky isnt gonna just stand in the middle of the ring and get tagged over and over…i think hatton gets around the ring very well…he isnt a slow plodder like some to tend to think of him as….
and kurt…i think the third man in the ring may have just as much to say about the outcome as the other two…i suspect that manny will hold the favor of whoever is in charge though…in fact when hatton fought floyd…i found a prop bet on hatton getting a point deducted…i believe it was around +600…i put a hundred on it for fun…and advised some friends to
March 31st, 2009 at 11:09 am
“the last time he fought a real fighter”…dunno how that got in there…disregard
March 31st, 2009 at 11:31 am
Well I’ve had this disagreement with a few boxing buddies about DeLaHoya and weight. I personally don’t think it played any role in the Pacquiao fight. If he cut the weight a day or two before the fight, then yeah, I can see where it could be argued that he had to dry out to make weight and was weak. If you watched HBO’s 24/7 DeLaHoya was at 147 on Thanksgiving over a week before the fight. He was adjusted to lower weight and was talking about how “energiezed” he felt. The thing about Oscar is it’s always some bullshit reason he lost. In 2004, I saw him live against Felix Sturm at 158. He talked about how “energized” he felt, then went out and fought like he did against Pacquiao: slow, plodding, confused. He should have lost that fight.
Oscar’s real problem has been speed and desire, not weight. Oscar has slowed down over the past 5-6 years but more importantly has shown little real interest in being a “fighter”. He’s a businessman. He blames Freddie Roach for having a poor fight plan, he brings in all these trainers, he blames his weight, his sparring partners, etc….it’s Oscar.
The thing about Hatton is if he didn’t become a much, much better defensive fighter since Mayweather, he’s in big trouble. I watched that fight again a week or so ago and was shocked at how many lead right hands Hatton ate that night. Mayweather nailed him whenever he wanted. I think Pacquiao is going to have an even easier time nailing him. He’s quicker that Floyd. But I don’t think he hits with anywhere near the same power as Mayweather…so I’ll bet a TKO stoppage due to cuts say in the 9th round. What’s the line at that outcome Ricky?
March 31st, 2009 at 12:47 pm
brad…havent seen any props on the fight yet online…just a straight line
and yer right about de la hoya…but its still the same problem in evaluating pac…oscar has little to no desire…and is always talking up how ready to go is prefight…basically pac fights mexicans who stand right in front of you…and when he fought a real skilled fighter in JMM, some of us come away wondering if he one either of those two fights
“I watched that fight again a week or so ago and was shocked at how many lead right hands Hatton ate that night. Mayweather nailed him whenever he wanted. I think Pacquiao is going to have an even easier time nailing him. He’s quicker that Floyd.”
u shouldnt be that shocked…floyd loves the lead rights..and he lands them on just about anyone…i dont think pac is quicker than floyd…i think it may appear that way…cause pac is like windup toy and floyd its more calculated and doesnt bounce in rhythm…but i tend to think floyd works pac…mainly because pac wont land his lead lefts at will against floyd
March 31st, 2009 at 1:42 pm
I think Floyd lands the lead right because Hatton is easy to hit. Floyd may love the lead right, but it’s still a bit of a sucker punch that top fighters don’t get caught with much-a good fighter will make you pay an awful price if you continually try lead rights. The other thing I noticed was how Hatton appeared to get alligator arms once he was inside. He rarely hooked to the body, or turned his weight into any of the blows, or even shot upper cuts on Floyd once he was inside. Instead he’d stand straight in front of him and throw short, straight punches that seemed to have no real power to them. Floyd would simply turn to avoid them…We’ll see in a month, but I don’t see Hatton doing anything with Pacquiao. Hatton is a character but I don’t see as a very special fighter.
March 31st, 2009 at 7:20 pm
I’m enjoying you two go back and forth analyzing the fight. I don’t have a library of past fights for me to rewatch anymore, aside from what is available on the net, but one thing strikes me as ominous: I don’t think Paq can look any better than he did against DLH, and I don’t see Hatton looking any worse than he did vs. Floyd. Floyd Sr, while no Freddie Roach, should make Hatton a tougher man to beat than what Floyd Jr. encountered.
The thing that worries me is that if Hatton wins, I think boxing loses. Maybe I’m too influenced by Large’s anti-Hatton sentiment, but we need our champions to be able to truly box, and box in a manner that fans of the sport can appreciate. I don’t see it with Hatton, and aside from 4 or 5 notable fighters, he seemed to fight a lot of duds while in England.
This year, we have learned that anything is possible in this sport– I’m still shocked and upset about Margs and what he did to Cotto’s (my favorite fighter) career. I have a bet with a British friend that Paq will win, but I’m still nervous.
March 31st, 2009 at 10:30 pm
Dmitriy Salita brought jewish fans back to boxing
But antisemitic and corrupted boxing executives boycote and defamate jewish people. It is not taking place in some third world country, – it’s happening right here in New York where jewish population is second to Israel.
Read Thomas Houser article how many nobody’s get on HBO, and they turned down Salita Vs Gavin Reyes, Salita – Mallignagie,
Salita – Kotelnik, – it’s a crime against Salita and against jewish people
March 31st, 2009 at 10:34 pm
Antisemitism and corruption go hand in hand. So, many dates for Golden Boy at the cost of other boxers and promoters. Fights that have to take place in New York get shifted to West coast, it is not good for NY economy.
April 1st, 2009 at 4:39 am
Kopper we all see things differently. The beauty of this place is there seems to be a basic respect of other opinions. Having said that, I do, respectfully, disagree with your statement that you can’t see “Hatton looking worse” than he did against Mayweather. He looked worse in next fight against Juan Lazcano. Lazcano was 33 years old and hadn’t fought in 15 months before Hatton. I always felt Hatton had limited skills but that fight showed he was past his peak of “limited” abilities. I thought Hatton won the fight by a few rounds, but this was suppose to be an easy confidence builder. Instead it showed all Ricky’s flaws, he misses alot, he easy to hit, he’s very predictable, etc. The thing about Hatton is any technically sound fighter gives him a hard time or beats him. Even when he was in his prime. He’s past that. The only thing he has going for him is that he hustles. His problem, come May, is he’s fighting a guy who’s not on a downward trajectory, who’s technically sound, and hustles even more than Hatton. I mean break the fight down in your head: Offense-Pacquiao, defense-Pacquiao, quality of opposition-Pacquiao, speed-Pacqiuao….I even give the hustle edge, that Hatton always wins, to Pacquiao. I wouldn’t be nervous about your bet. It’s in the bag. Is your British friend looking for any more action?
April 1st, 2009 at 6:14 am
Our bet was for a night of beer, next time we go out. Come to NYC and I think we could round up enough No Masians to take care of your beer, so consider it done. If the economy were not in its current state, and my business didn’t need me there every day, I would try to go to the Paq/Hatton fight. I went to Calzaghe/Jones and even though the fight was 1 sided, those Brits sure can create atmosphere. I bet Hatton will have his small army in attendance.
April 1st, 2009 at 6:41 am
Kopper I tried to get tickets for that fight through ticketmaster but they only floated out 2,000 to the general public. They were gone in seconds. The casino’s had the rights to all the other ones. I contacted Dena duBoef, she’s in charge of marketing at Top Rank, and she could get me 5 seats at $500 a pop for me and the boys(we were really looking for $200 dollar ones just to be in the arena). In a better market…maybe. Me and my friends had a few beers and thought about it and we decided to pass on it. Too rich. We’re idiots anyway. The flight,hotel and ticket would be the cheapest part of the trip, the casinos and bars would have all our money by the end of the weekend.
The trip I really want to make is to New York anyways. I will at some point make it happen, the Clottey-Cotto fight in June might be perfect. I plan on making a trip to Victor’s Cafe on W 52nd Street when I go, as a tip of my hat to my favorite all-time fighter Roberto Duran. Victor’s was the place Duran always went to celebrate after fights. If I’m not mistaken they have a huge painting of him hanging in the bar area. Cuban food in a place that has a painting of Stone Hands in NYC on a fight weekend….sounds like a pretty good time to me.
April 1st, 2009 at 8:58 am
Salita-HBO situation was discussed on russian radio for 2 hours this morning
Russian jews and jews from crown are protesting.
You treat Salita the same way you treated Joe Luis
when he fought Max Shmeling. It sets up bad example to jewish kids – you can be #1 and not given fight on TV because you are not spanish…
Capitalism exuse doesn’t work guys from russia, europe and Africa fight on HBO nobody knows who they are until they fight on HBO.
Exuse Salita didn’t or don’t wanna fight nobody
doesn’t work either because his proposed fights
with Gavin Reyes, Paul Malignaggie, Andreas Kotelnik all were turned down by HBO
Salita is official challenger to fight Andreas Kotelnik, no exuses – it’s racism.
Racism is not necessarily whites against black,
it can be blacks against whites, or spanish against whites.
Don’t treat us like second class citizens because we
are jewish
April 1st, 2009 at 9:49 pm
the hallmark of the Boxing After Dark franchise, featuring rising stars along with up and coming fighters and providing them a great showcase to demonstrate their talent,†said Luis Barragan, director of programming, HBO Sports. …
P.S. Really…?
April 2nd, 2009 at 6:06 pm
Seva Kaplan proposed russian jews should cancel HBO
#1. There hundreds of thousands russian jews in New York thousands of them have HBO if we cancel HBO subscription perhaps they will aknowledge that we exist, not only spanish viewers – for anti-semitism we should punish them moneywise. So, when you call your cable and ask to cancel HBO, reason – discrimination of jewish boxer Dmitriy Salita.
Seva Kaplan proposed american jewish community should cancel HBO as well
#2. Let them feel that we exist, let show them our jewish fist, every jewish family from East to West cost should cancel HBO. If Louis Barragan wants HBO to be only for latinos, Germany only for Germans – let it be this way.
You are boycoting Salita, we american jews will answer you with jewish boycot of HBO. We can survive without HBO, especially at the time of recession.
April 3rd, 2009 at 6:19 am
Boycott the network that has given us Curb Your Enthusiasm?…..I don’t know man.
April 3rd, 2009 at 7:02 am
By the way, Ron Ross has a excellent piece on Morris Reif in Boxing Digest this month. George Kimball, one of my favorite boxing writers, also writes about Jose Torres…good stuff.
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