I was surprised by the recent news that Oscar De La Hoya was planning a tune-up fight for May before his now seemingly certain rematch with Floyd in September. But when I heard the three potential opponents he was considering – Stevie Forbes, Paulie Malignaggi and Dmitriy Salita – I was completely blown away. Going to fights in New York, I’ve been following both Malignaggi and Salita for years, and I still to this day count Salita’s march into the ring with the rapping Matisyahu for his fight with Shawn Gallegos to be the greatest ring entrance I’ve ever seen.
If you’re unfamiliar with Salita, he’s a Ukrainian-born fighter who moved to Brooklyn when he was nine and learned the fight game under the tutelage of local legend Jimmy O’Pharrow at the Starrett City Boxing Club. Dmitriy is also an observant Orthodox Jew, which has brought him a lot of attention and a passionate fan base in the city. His story is remarkable, and it’s told in Jason Hutt’s new documentary, Orthodox Stance, which has its last showing at the Jewish Film Festival in New York tonight and then opens in the city starting Friday.
The first person I thought of when I heard the news about Oscar’s plans was Kurt Emhoff, who is Dmitriy’s attorney and who once represented Malignaggi. No Masians probably know Kurt from the comments pages (where, very sneakily, he calls himself “Kurt”), and I know him as an insightful and articulate guy who is a veritable treasure trove of information about the fight game. As you can imagine, this is a very crazy time for him, but nevertheless, he was gracious enough to give me an interview last night about these most exciting recent developments.
L: Kurt, I’m very interested with this Dmitriy/Oscar situation in hearing how the whole thing started. Did you contact Oscar’s people or did they contact you?
Kurt: I actually read Dan Rafael on ESPN.com about how Dan had spoken with Richard Schaeffer (Golden Boy CEO) about it, and then I started getting calls from people all over boxing. Golden Boy hadn’t reached out to me, so I ended up reaching out to Golden Boy, and it’s a good thing I did because apparently Shelly Finkel called Dmitriy and said, ‘look I can get you the fight done, I can make it happen,†and then basically he started unilaterally negotiating with Golden Boy on Dmitriy’s behalf.
L: (laughing) Wow.
Kurt: (also laughing) Yeah. It’s a dirty business man. Dmitriy had told me that Shelly called, but then when I talked to Golden Boy myself and told Dmitriy what Shelly had done, he was completely disgusted.
L: So the timeline is that you started hearing whispers around the boxing world that the idea was in the atmosphere and then you made the call to Golden Boy?
Kurt: Right. I made the call to Golden Boy because I know Dave Itskowitch, the COO at Golden Boy. He used to be Lou DiBella’s right-hand man, so we’re very tight with Dave. Actually, that’s really how I found about this initially, because Golden Boy thought that Lou still promoted Dmitriy and they contacted him. Lou called me and told me that De La Hoya was interested and that I should give them a call.
L: Where do you think the idea for Dmitriy as an opponent for Oscar came from? Because it’s definitely not the most natural match-up out there.
Kurt: Well, you know, I think Oscar is looking for a tune-up fight before Floyd, and the best thing to do is take on a naturally smaller guy. A naturally smaller guy who doesn’t have a lot of punching power. That’s the logic they’re using. So they’re looking at junior welterweights who HBO wouldn’t be completely offended by for an Oscar fight. You got Stevie Forbes, former world champion, just had a nice win on pay-per-view over Francisco Bojado, and he’s affiliated with “The Contender,” so that ups his profile. Paulie, obviously, is a world champion, and Golden Boy has ties with Lou DiBella (Malignaggi’s promoter), they’ve done a lot of business with him.
L: Where do the negotiations stand right now?
Kurt: Well, basically Golden Boy has an idea of their budget, and everyone’s making their pitch to them about why they should get the fight. It’s kind of a beauty contest at this point. The bottom line I think is that they’re looking for the person they can get the cheapest. I’m not sure they really have a preference beyond that.
L: This is not a pay-per-view fight, right?
Kurt: Right, it’s regular HBO, so it’s not this big upside for money. It’s a cut-and-dried budget, and Golden Boy is just looking for that fighter who’s willing to, you know, get in there with Oscar and move up two weight classes and fight him in his hometown (laughs).
L: Well, on that score, there are a lot of other junior welterweights out there that people know who Oscar could beat and that have bigger names than Dmitriy. I’m thinking that Dmitriy’s story, and now the release of the movie, must play a role in Oscar’s interest. Do you think that’s true?
Kurt: I definitely think so. Dmitriy sent out invitations before any of this happened to Richard Schaeffer and Dave Itskowitch to attend the movie. And, you know, the documentary is amazing.
L: You’re happy with the movie?
Kurt: Oh very, very. Jason Hutt is a tremendously talented filmmaker and he followed Dmitriy with a camera for three to four years and really did an amazing job of capturing any number of things. Not just your usual boxer-in-training type shots either, but also of Dmitry’s conversion to being an Orthodox and observant Jew and how the community views him and views boxing and the conflict between his faith and a violent sport. And, you know, it’s also the classic story of an immigrant just trying to make it in Brooklyn. Plus, as an attorney in the sport one part of it I really think is compelling is that Lou DiBella actually allowed Jason to capture some of the negotiations of the promotional contract with Dmitriy. And, well, I suspect that material will confirm some people’s thoughts about the way things go in boxing (laughing).
L: Wow. And DiBella signed off on that?
Kurt: Yeah. Lou’s seen the movie and he likes it. You know, Lou for the most part is an open book. Things didn’t work out between him and Dmitriy, but that doesn’t change the fact that he’s a pretty fair, what-you-see-is-what-you-get kind of guy.
L: So you guys are still on good terms with Lou? I mean, you must be if he’s willing to call and give you the Oscar tip even after Dmitiriy had broken with him.
Kurt: Oh yeah, definitely. We parted on amicable terms. DiBella put out a press release that was very positive, and we’ve been very positive, and you know, it’s just one of those things. Dmitriy wanted to pursue things on his own, no hard feelings. But Lou’s a good guy and I would without question take fighters to Lou again. I think he’s still the best promoter in New York, the East Coast for the most part.
L: So back to the Oscar question, Kurt – when do you think it’s all gonna go down? When will we know?
Kurt: I think it’s going to happen by the end of the week. They want to get it wrapped up and get the promotion started. They don’t want to drag it out. And we’d like to know as well, because there are a lot of issues to work out for us well. I mean, if the fight is on the west coast it may pose a big problem for Dmitriy with Shabbat and sundown and the timing of the fight.
L: Man, that’s interesting. I never would have even thought about that.
Kurt: Yeah, well look, HBO is a New York-based company that caters to the East Coast. I don’t know that they’d want to bring the main event on much later than 11 or 11:30, especially when it’s regular HBO. That could be a problem for us with sundown. Dmitriy’s going to need at least an hour to warm up before the fight.
L: And on a Saturday right, he won’t do anything until sundown.
Kurt: Right.
L: Wow. I, ah… I gotta think that as far as a big-time fight goes, and I know that there’s no title at stake here, but still right now whenever Oscar fights it’s a big-time fight… and for a fight of this magnitude I have to imagine this is an issue that’s never been dealt with before.
Kurt: Not that I know of. And yeah, it’s definitely a big deal, because Dmitriy is living it, you know. He’s observant.
L: I know, I know. Man. All right, so let me change the subject here and ask you about Dmitriy’s prospects against Oscar. Obviously he’d be a heavy underdog, but to me it seems like a Paulie/Cotto situation, where if Dmitriy goes in there and gives a really good account of himself, he changes his career incalculably even if he loses.
Kurt: Without question. Dmitriy definitely has his critics right now, people saying that he hasn’t stepped up and taken big fights. MaxBoxing did an article where they presented that very issue to us. But, you know, to be willing to jump up two weight divisions to fight the biggest star in the sport, a certain Hall of Famer and a guy who last year lost a split decision to the best fighter in the game… I mean, let’s face it, Oscar still has some heat on the fastball. To take him on in Mexico in front of a hundred-twenty thousand fans – that’s big balls right there. And if Dmitriy could give him a run for his money in those circumstances, there’s no question his stock goes way way up. Plus, there’s just the cultural dimension of it. I don’t think an orthodox Jew has ever fought for a title or, you know, occupied that type of air space where you’re fighting an Oscar De La Hoya. It’s just huge all around.
L: One more thing, Kurt. I know you used to represent Paulie , you have much to do with him anymore?
Kurt: Not that much business-wise. We’re still very friendly. I actually got him an endorsement not too long ago. I’m a big Paulie fan.
L: So obviously you’re competing with Paulie’s people for this fight. That said, what do you think are his chances of getting in there with Oscar?
Kurt: Well, it’s interesting with Paulie, because he actually has more to risk. He’s a titlist at 140 already, and then if he steps up and takes the Oscar fight and looks terrible in there and gets blown out, I’m not sure people are even going to want to see him fight Ricky Hatton. So I think that’s kind of weighed into the calculation. If Oscar’s offering relatively short money for an Oscar fight, do you make as much or more in a more competitive fight with Hatton? Because I think it’s fairly certain that they can make the Hatton fight.
L: No kidding? Really?
Kurt: Yeah. Hatton doesn’t really want to fight Junior Witter, and Ricardo Torres doesn’t mean anything to him. That leaves Paulie as the most compelling fight for him.
L: All right Kurt, thanks a lot for your time, and know that all of us here at No Mas are rooting hard for Dmitriy in this one. Take care.
Kurt: Thanks Large.
(One final note for all you New York No Masians out there – Orthodox Stance makes its final appearance in the Jewish Film Festival tonight at Walter Reade, 8 p.m. I haven’t seen the movie, but all reports I’ve heard are that it’s excellent. Our crack correspondent, No Mas Nick Strini, will be on the scene to give us a full report.)